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Talk:Arnett McMillan/@comment-197.89.18.94-20160219173623/@comment-197.89.126.169-20160228093620
OrigAnon: @Anon: Let me start off by saying that I'll back off and try not to type anything more after this. As I said above I accept maybe I'm convincing myself of something that isn't, I'm more than willing to accept I might be wrong. At the same time that doesn't change that I feel concerned for Elizabeth and André's relationship because I don't like that a potential way to casually destroy it has been introduced in the first place. But I respect that I'm overreacting and should wait and see what happens. (Admittedly I would still like to then know what the narrative point of those scenes were). With that admission out of the way first I'll still try to respond to what you said. Just wanted to first recognize that I'm being to negative and wallowing in it doesn't help. When you say 'pushing' the NTR angle I'm not exactly sure what you mean. I certainly am confident I'm not the only one who's expressed fear/discomfort at the idea and I know I'm also not one of the many who've expressed optimism at the idea. If I remember correctly the myanimelist comments on those two chapters tended to mostly be along the lines of 'NTR king', 'cool here comes an NTR harem' and a few mean spirited 'just get rid of all the Limiters, they're useless anyway'. I know there are people on animesuki and mangafox who've also expressed distaste and dislike of the scenario. If you mean I'm the only one currently typing about it, sure, yes, you are totally right about that. As for Elizabeth and Arnett's reactions, hmmm, as I've said on the one hand I am glad for the inclusion of the scenes. I wish the two didn't have to blush so heavily throughout them, but I am glad that the two expressed their explicit dislike of what happened and that they explicitly held no emotional connection to Kazuya. At the same time I can't help but feel trepidation, though, because I know that in NTR/Mind Break and such genre's scenes like that usually exist (strong female characters displaying defiance) to make the eventual humiliation/submission/degradation more 'satisfying' for the audience. Arnett and Elizabeth's combination of aggression, significant others, strong wills and agency make them seem like fodder for so many NTR-type situations I've had the misfortune of knowing. So the scene, yes, is something I am glad was included. But at the same time I can't help but also feel wary. After all what is the narrative purpose of having Kazuya's power engender feelings of slavish devotion in the Pandora, of having the Limiter's expressly seem terrified of the what happened unless it has a pay off of some sort later in the story? If all that was needed was a power up why purposefully write it that the power up also affects Arnett, Elizabeth and Ticy in such a way that it had obvious NTR overtones. I do mean that, the initial reaction across the internet to the chapters was to identify it as having NTR overtones. Am I perhaps overanalysing things then? Then am I scared. Yes. Very. Obviously its hard to ever actually convey emotional understanding but the truth is I'm very worried. Elizabeth and André (and any of the other couples actually) all being reduced in nature is a genuine fear of mine now. After all why give Kazuya a power which explicitly makes Pandora's (most of whom all have significant others already) forget any emotional connection they have to their partner? Like with the example of the husband I used above the implications are very distressing to me. If I'm sitting at home knowing that my Husband (and many others but I'm just using the one husband to correlate the example to Elizabeth and André's circumstance) is currently repeatedly engaging in an intensely intimate process with another person (and that I know this process feels better for my husband than anything I can ever do, that it makes my husband forget about any feelings he has for me and makes my husband wish to surrender everything they are to this person) how am I meant to feel about my relationship? Then you mention 'Kazuya one loves Satellizer (and Rana too probably)' and there I think lies the crux of one part of my fears which is perhaps not self-evident. I don't want Elizabeth and André's relationship to be a matter of Elizabeth thinking to herself 'If Kazuya was willing to take me I'd drop André in a heartbeat for him' and have it that the Pandora all only settle for other people in their lives because Kazuya isn't willing to take them. I want Elizabeth's relationship with André to be a matter of 'we love each other, wish to be in a mutually exclusive relationship with each other and only each other, and are going to work on this relationship of ours'. Having the Pandora simply 'settle' for other significant others because Kazuya won't accept them means that none of them love their respective partners. So I don't want a situation where Elizabeth 'settles' for André but would throw him aside like a used rag if Kazuya ever actually told her too. Again beyond not liking the relationship being destroyed that reduces Elizabeth (and all the Pandora) to entities with no agency or emotional nuance. Also, I should make clear, I'm not scared that Kazuya's going to do it on purpose (though of course the fact that he can is truly sad to me since it means André and Elizabeth's relationship only exists because Kazuya permits it, if Kazuya wanted Elizabeth there is nothing André or Elizabeth could ever do to stop him now, which, again, I imagine if I knew that I had an acquaintance who, if they wanted, could always make my husband kill me for them, and that would make my relationship with my husband almost impossible since how could I ever feel that I'm actually the person they love when I know that if this person wanted them too they'd happily kill me for). What I'm sacred of is the process happening regardless. If the Limiters and all partnerships are now dissolved, as seems to be Gengo's intent, and all Pandora's are from now on forced to consistently undergo this process with Kazuya, I'm worried of it happening regardless of Kazuya's intention. I know Elizabeth was willing to quit being a Pandora once for André but, sadly, I highly doubt the author is going to have Elizabeth leave the story completely this time, meaning I assume she'll from now on, like Arnett and the others in that image, simply be permanently partnered to Kazuya and only Kazuya. Also, though I appreciate you're encouragement, that something 'cool' is going to happen, and legitimately I am glad you are enjoying it and offered me this reassurance...I just don't see what I can be optimistic about. What I found most 'cool' about Freezing was definitely André and Elizabeth. The recent chapters indicate I'll probably never see the two together again. Anyway, sorry for the long spiel, I know the body was very negative, but I'm trying to be more positive about this now. I'll wait and see, internalize and adopt the assurances here that it won't happen, and believe that some of the things I want to see will still happen. Particularly between Elizabeth and André.